DharmAI

Wanting to ordain or go much deeper

Raṭṭhapāla told a king why a young man of means went forth: the world is unstable and carried off, it offers no shelter, nothing in it is one's own, and it is never satisfied. His parents were not persuaded and the sutta records that too. The canon takes the wish to renounce seriously and it also knows the wish to escape, and it does not always tell them apart for you. The passages here lay out the reasoning, the duties that going forth leaves behind, and what wanting looks like when it has put on robes. Whether to ordain is a question for a teacher and a community, over time, and the suttas would say so.

What the suttas say

  1. Mendicants, form is not-self. For if form were self, it wouldn’t lead to affliction. And you could compel form: ‘May my form be like this! May it not be like that!’

    The argument from affliction — if it were yours, you could make it stay.

    Where this stops: Directed at monks already practising; it is not a reply to grief and should not be offered as one.

    SN 22.59:2.1–2.3 · The Characteristic of Not-Self

  2. ‘The world has no shelter and no savior.’ This is the second summary. ‘The world has no owner—you must leave it all behind and pass on.’ This is the third summary. ‘The world is wanting, insatiable, the slave of craving.’

    Raṭṭhapāla's four summaries — the reasons a young man of means went forth, given to a king who asked.

    Where this stops: A renunciant's reasoning laid out for someone considering it; not a case that everyone should leave home, and the sutta is explicit that his parents were not persuaded.

    MN 82:36.3–36.7 · With Raṭṭhapāla

  3. don’t go by oral transmission, don’t go by lineage, don’t go by testament, don’t go by canonical authority, don’t rely on logic, don’t rely on inference, don’t go by reasoned train of thought, don’t go by the acceptance of a view after deliberation, don’t go by the appearance of competence, and don’t think “The ascetic is our respected teacher.” But when you know for yourselves:

    The Kālāma discourse — the canon's charter for testing teachings.

    Where this stops: It is not permission to believe whatever one likes; it ends with what the wise praise. Never a reason to stay with a teacher who is doing harm.

    AN 3.65:25.3–25.4 · With the Kālāmas of Kesamutta

  4. Householders, if wife and husband want to see each other in both this life and the next, they should be equals in faith, ethics, generosity, and wisdom.

    Nakula's parents — the Buddha's picture of a good partnership.

    Where this stops: A picture of a partnership both people want; not a standard to measure a partner who broke faith against, and not a reason to stay.

    AN 4.55:3.1 · Equality (1st)

  5. Mendicants, suppose this Ganges River was carrying along a big lump of foam. And a person with clear eyes would see it and contemplate it, examining it rationally. And it would appear to them as completely vacuous, hollow, and insubstantial. For what essence could there be in a lump of foam? In the same way, a mendicant sees and contemplates any kind of form at all—past, future, or present; internal or external; solid or subtle; inferior or superior; far or near—examining it rationally. And it appears to them completely vacuous, hollow, and insubstantial. For what essence could there be in form?

    The lump of foam — looked at closely, it appears empty and without core, and so does form when examined the same way. The canon's way of asking for close looking without claiming that nothing is real.

    Where this stops: Said to monks, and applied in turn to all five aggregates (feeling, perception, mental formations, and consciousness follow). It describes how form appears when examined, not whether a job, a marriage, or a life is worth anything, and it is not a reply to loss.

    SN 22.95:2.1–2.2 · A Lump of Foam